Friday, January 13, 2012

The Flying Spaghetti Straw Man

Recently on the campus of the University of Central Arkansas (UCA), a former student of mine was handed a pamphlet by a fellow student, espousing the virtues of the “Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster" (CFSM). Its members call themselves "Pastafarians" and dress like pirates.

Background

The fliers are distributed by a real student group (The Secular Student Alliance), but the CFSM is not a real church. It is a parody religion that was invented by a secular humanist (atheist) in order to make a particular point. In 2005, the Kansas State Board of Education was debating whether to add Intelligent Design (ID) to their curriculum, teaching it alongside Darwinian evolution. In response, Bobby Henderson wrote an open letter to the local newspaper promoting a third view—that the world was created by the Flying Spaghetti Monster—that should be taught alongside evolution and ID. His point was to discredit the only other “religious” view—Intelligent Design. (Arguably atheism is a religious, theological position as well.) The atheist community has adopted the FSM argument and made it its own. Also, it seems that the FSM has become the mascot of atheism more broadly, rather than just a token of the evolution/ID culture war.

A Christian response

In the spirit of reason and love, I think the best course of action for Christians, such as my former student, is not to return in kind with equally caricatured parodies of atheism. As the late Francis Schaeffer writes in The God Who Is There, such a response reveals a desire to simply win an argument rather than a desire to love the people whose ideas you oppose. The right course of action ought to be to try to determine what exactly their objection (or argument) is and give a reasoned response to that argument. (see 1 Peter 3:15-17) So, what is their argument exactly?

Their argument

I take FSM as a de jure argument against the belief that God created the universe. This requires a bit of explanation. A de jure argument is one that states that it is irrational to believe proposition x. In contrast, a de facto argument states that argument x is simply false.

A de facto argument looks something like the following: It is false to believe that the dark side of the moon is covered with spiraling high-rise buildings. We've seen the dark side of the moon, and there are exactly zero high-rise buildings there. Therefore, the claim is false.

An example of a de jure argument is as follows: It is irrational to believe that there is a very sophisticated race of giant pink bunnies that live at the center of Mars. While this is a logical possibility, it is highly irrational to believe such a thing. People who espouse such views would be thought insane. The FSM argument, as far as I can tell, makes no claims that Christianity is false, but that it is irrational. Here are the premises:
  • Belief that the FSM is the creator of the world as we know it (A) is obviously irrational.
  • (A) and the belief that the Christian God is the creator of the world (B) are the same.
  • Therefore, (B) is obviously irrational.
Given the two premises, I agree that their conclusion is valid. However, the second premise [that (A) = (B)] is simply false; therefore, the conclusion must be false. We must examine the second premise.

My argument

The FSM argument is a straw man. Secular atheists have set up an argument that is allegedly equal to Christianity and attacked it. However, the belief in FSM and the belief in the Christian God are not even remotely comparable. The FSM argument is much weaker and, therefore, much more easily defeated. I agree with the secular humanists that belief in the FSM does not pass the threshold of rationality (what Plantinga calls “warrant”). Unlike the secular humanists; however, I believe that Christian belief does pass the threshold of rationality. It is warranted and, therefore, rational.

Christian belief is not limited to the proposition that some unknown and fantastical being created the cosmos. Even if we reduce orthodox Christianity to the lowest common doctrinal denominator (that which is held by Catholics, Protestants, and Orthodox traditions), Christianity is far more complex than the simple proposition that some being called “God” exists and created the world. To borrow C.S. Lewis' title, “mere Christianity” is a complex network of interlocking beliefs. The complexity of the structure corresponds to the complexity of this reality, of which it tries to make sense. An oversimplified belief structure, like FSM, is incapable of making sense of this complex reality we find ourselves inhabiting. This whole complex network of beliefs is called by philosophers a “noetic structure,” but more commonly it is called a “worldview.”

A worldview is a set of lenses (assumptions) through which we see the world, and everyone has a worldview—even atheists. Some worldviews adequately make sense of the world around us, and others do not. While the origin of biological life is certainly an important part of any worldview, it is not limited to this question. I can see why someone would have a hard time accepting the fact that life (or the whole universe) was created by an invisible God who has no sensible form. (I don't find the cosmological argument for the existence of God to be adequate alone.) However, Christians don't become Christians because of that belief alone. Most, I think, become and remain Christian because of the cumulative explanatory power of the whole Christian worldview. Christianity simply makes sense of the world around them. Even if you find a naturalistic form of Darwinian evolution superior as an explanation for the existence of the biodiversity we have today, pure naturalism absolutely fails to answer so many other important worldview questions, such as:
  • What is evil?
  • What is good?
  • What is friendship?
  • How can something come from nothing?
  • Why have the vast majority of humans in history been theistic?
  • How can you explain the remarkable cross-cultural consistency of the human moral code?
  • Why do we have a conscience?
  • Why do people adopt and love non-biological children?
  • Why do we feel compelled to make art?
  • How did organic life begin?
  • Why do firemen run into burning buildings to save strangers?
  • Why do some things strike us beautiful?
  • Why are people inherently drawn to happy endings and good superheros?
  • What is justice?
  • How can we know right from wrong?
  • Why do we even have categories for "right" and "wrong"?
  • Why does rape strike the human heart as inherently wrong?
  • Why do we demand justice when we're abused?
There are countless other questions that only Christianity is able to answer satisfactorily. (I welcome comments of other questions you may have.)

If atheists (or the supposed pirate Pastafarians) want to be taken seriously by Christians, they need to begin by answering these very serious human questions. To ignore these questions is to ignore what makes us human. Silly pamphlets and a single explanation of where we came from are not sufficient to win us over. Why should the question of origins receive supreme priority? Show us you actually care about our humanness and answer all the questions above. We've answered them. Now, it's your turn.

Conclusion

I do take the secular de jure argument seriously and have tried to offer a cogent and respectful argument in response. To those who are atheists, I hope this is received in the same spirit of love in which it was intended. I want human-to-human conversation, rather than shouting and hate. If any "Christians" have responded with hate, let it be condemned here. I suspect that Christians and atheists alike tend to respond with vitriol when they don't know how to make an argument in response. It may be that they are afraid their whole worldview might be torn down. That can be terrifying, and fear produces anger. That is why the loving thing to do, on both sides, is to stay calm and present each side accurately and fairly. I welcome all comments that are fair, reasoned, and seeking after common truth. 

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Special thanks to my senior Bible classes for helping me to think through this issue. You are exceptional people, and I'm blessed to know you and serve you as your teacher. Thanks to: Kirsten, Kirk, William D., Jake, Cory, Kimmy, Luke, Allison, Breanna, Camille, Jamie, Jenny, Lance, Drue, Jacob, Harrison, Ethan, Bradley, Austin, Maci, Rebekah, Calli, Tyler, Robbi, Shandi, and Sarah Jo.

45 comments:

  1. It seems to me part of the disrespect Christians garner comes from reductionist slogans like "God said it, I believe it, that settles it," or from blithely and incredulously declaring that we cannot understand how anyone could be an atheist when he looks at the seashore. What we really mean is something quite different, of course. We mean that we have reached a place where the personal struggles in our faith are no longer with who God is and with his authority, and we mean that, having come to that place of faith, we understand that the creation glorifies the Creator. I just think that reducing the arguments for faith to a sound bite or a bumper sticker or a little sign to be purchased at the Christian Bookstore -- to be treated like a mantra for the faithful or used as a Facebook status -- somehow feels more about self-congratulation and less about usefulness, and it actually hurts the cause of faith. And don't even get me started on those "Testamints" they sell at the cash register...go ahead and call me a curmudgeon...

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  2. Anonymous,your criticism of reductionist slogans is right on. I very rarely go to Christian book stores or listen to Christian radio for that reason. I guess the problem lies in the fast pace of commercial culture; there is on only time for a soundbite. Something as complex as an entire belief system simply can't fit in a soundbite.

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  3. Very interesting!!! I have always heard that a college campus is a place where a person's faith is tested and this seems to help this argument. Christians have to be strong in their faith and be Biblically rooted if we are to defend our faith. We do not have to know all of the answers, just know wherer to find them, the BIBLE.

    Anna Cain

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  4. This just makes me laugh. I think that these atheistic people just came up with something to fill the void they must have from the absence of God in their lives. The claim that the FSM created the world is totally irrational, and while these people must be trying to somehow mirror their view of Christianity, they have made a ridiculous attempt of it. I think these people could use a nice reading in Mere Christianity!
    Kimmy Hays

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  5. "Have you been touched by his noodly appendage?" It is a cute pamphlet, but it does little for the cause of atheism. It does seem to pack a little more punch in the Evolution vs. Intelligent Design area, though. I would enjoy reading a blog about that if you ever get the time.

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  6. The whole reason atheists do this is to make fun of Christians. Theyr'e making some unrealistic creature up to symbolize our belief in God. This pamphlet was irritating when I first saw it but if you think about it, it didn't really do anything for atheists at all. They have attacked Christianity but we shouldn't let it get to us and stoop to their level.

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  7. I agree with what Cory said- the FSM was created to get under our skin and we should not retaliate the way our human nature tells us to. Your conclusion sums it up for me-people are scared that their entire belief system or worldview will be torn down in an instant which produces fear and anger. I believe that many Christians feel the same way; they haven't asked themeselves some really hard questions concerning God (EX: why is there pain and suffereing?), and this can be used by the devil to trick them into thinking their worldview is not the correct one. I think one solution to this problem is that we as a church need to start asking the hard questions during our sermons and Bible studies-especially to teenagers and college students who will be the most exposed to other worldviews. This way Christians will be better prepared to intelligently answer questions asked by an athiest or secular humanist.

    Allison Hopkins

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  8. Mr. Mooney,

    I clearly remember talking about this in class and inside I was completely amazed on how someone could believe something like the FSM. The world is full of different religions and ideas of how Earth actually created. I also second Cory's comment about them making fun of Christianity, but reality is that some people believe it. First of all, they were really immature about the whole situation by starting it in the first place. Although it makes me angry as a Christian, I simply wouldn't act on it because thats the right thing to do. Let them think what they want. God is the judge in the end. Not us.

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  9. I also remember hearing about this and class, and I was also utterly wowed at someone who would hand out fliers for the FSM. This is ridiculous, and it totally appalls me. I hate how much disrespect is aimed and Christ and Christians. Even though it's is terrible and immature it is still bound to happen because we are fallen, sinful people.
    Logan

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  10. As soon as I heard about the Flying Spaghetti Monster, I was outraged. I wanted to respond with angry and hate, but you've made a good point about not responding that way.
    Olivia Meriweather

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  11. when i heard about the flying speghetti monster i instantly wanted to talk to the creator. It is one thing to not believe in something, but to mock someones beliefs is another thing entirely. As christians, when we see something like this the only thing that we can do is try to talk to the person and pray for them.
    Cody Morris

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  12. I rememeber you talking about this in class one day. I see the fake Jesus fish symbol with the legs all the time on cars and it makes me so mad. I honestly think it is a waste of time for atheists to make up this junk. They might think it is funny making fun of Christians but no one is laughing except them. They won't be laughing when Jesus comes back to earth with anger on them. I also think it is funny how atheists attack Christianity but not any other religion. Like why Christianity? Is it because it makes the most sense but they just don't want to believe it is true? (Because it is the truth) Is it because most people believe in it? Why is it? I would like to think that most Christians do not attack other religions, such as atheists(FSM), but sometimes they do out of anger or because they think they are making a point and trying to help them, but their not. I agree with you on how Christians should not argue with hatred, but simply discuss and show them the way. (The Bible) I enjoyed this blog and I hope and pray that I may be calm to non-Christians when they present an argument against my Father as I enter into college. Thanks for the advice.
    McKenzie T.

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  13. I believe that this belief of the Flying Spaghetti Monster is just simply created out of spite. It is to make fun of Christians and what we believe. I do recall you talking about this in class and to me it seemed humerus. I thought it was stupid and couldn't believe that people could actually come up with something like this and actually believe in such a thing. To me, I feel they are just making fun of Christianity and trying to fill the whole they have in themselves without Jesus Christ. I was driving one day and was behind a car that had this Jesus fish on the back of it with legs and stuff on it and in the middle said FSM. It made me quite angry. I was like wow, this is really real and people are making it know to everyone that they believe in this. I was just shocked, I guess. The questions that you ask would never be able to be answer by these "Pastafarians".
    I have always heard that in college is where your faith gets tested, whether you continue to go to church and so on. I know when I go to college I will not let this bring me down and continue to grow in my faith with Jesus Christ.

    -Regan Bell

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  14. My co-workers(mostly UCA students) distribute the FSM pamphlet around my work. Knowing that im a christian, they have confronted and taunted me about my beliefs. Your article gives useful insight into how to react to these confrontations. Its easy to react with anger, but that would be exactly what they want me to do. Treating them with love could have a bigger impact on their life than promoting argument and hate.
    Landon Meriweather

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  15. The thing that bothers me so much about this pamphlet is not the fact that it was made to oppose and make fools of Christians. If someone does not agree with me, I still want to hear their arguments and proof. What bothers me so much is that instead of being mature and intellegent, they just made a pamphlet mocking Christianity. If you disagree or find another belief to be unbelieveable, the instead of wasting time making fun, why not put that same time to good use and figure out WHY you believe what you believe and use that to show people how credible your view is and wrong the other is. I just cannot see how any good comes out of this- for athiests or Christians. Christains, obviously, gain nothing from this. But what do athiests gain? A laugh? It is not like they are proving anything by writing this, or showing the world "Look how smart and right we are". Are they so intellegent for taking Christianity and replacing God with spaghetti? I don't think I expressed how I feel about this clearly, but I hope you can at least get the jist of what I am trying to say.

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  16. This is a very interesting article. I like how you addressed the issue on how to respond to these people. When they mock our beliefs we should not try to beat them by winning the argument. We should care for them and try to get them to see the truth. I feel that if we were just trying to win an argument with them, it would drive them even further away from our faith. We need to respectfully respond and show them that we care.

    -Matt Austin

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  17. Good point on how to respond to these people. A strong Christian base before you get to a College Campus is essential in avoiding these strong willed people.

    BigWillyDen

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  18. Matthew 5:11-12 says, "Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you." Though these atheists are mocking Christianity, we have to remember that we're setting an example as Christ followers and have to have the ability to control our anger. We have to continue to pray for them and most of all, love them. Jesus didn't care what people said about Him. He did what His Father asked though it caused hardship. We have to continue to pray for peace and strength of mind, as well as for the mockers.

    Jamie Potter

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  19. I like how your blog doesn't jump right out and attack the people, but discusses both sides of the issue and explains why they are wrong. When i first heard about the FSM i was really upset about it, but after reading your blog it showed me their reasons for creating the FSM and how to respond to them. It doesn't bother me now that they are trying to make fun of us because after all isn't that what Christ said would happen? I really enjoyed reading through this and hopefully i'll be able to use some of your points when i go to college.

    Kayla Williams

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  20. I agree with what you say in this article. Honestly, it would be hard for me to respond to this nonsense with love because it makes me so mad. While there are hundreds of other beliefs in the world, they choose Christianity to mock and ridicule. This shows me that Christianity is the one worldview that all the others are threatened by. For what other reason would they create a meatball and noodle that flys around the universe? If I ever encounter someone with this worldview I will have to remember to show them love and compassion because that is the complete opposite way they want me to act. Gracie Beckman

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  21. I do agree that the FSM group was simply created to mock Christianity and to get under our skin. With this in mind, I think that it would be harmful to Christianity for Christians to respond with hate.

    ~Jessa Wilson

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  22. Being from our small Christian School we are not used to having other religions challenge ours. When we get out in the real world we will be attatcked by them becuase of our faith. I think you nailed it right on the head when you talked about not replying with anger. That would just put us on there level in a way. We should pray for the lost and hope they see there evil ways.

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  23. Having gone to CCS all my life, i've never been questioned about my faith or really had to defend it. I think that it is very important to learn how to defend what I believe in high school and be able to share it with those that may question or judge me for it once I get into college or even after that. -Andrew Steely

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  24. I'm actually very familiar with people who challenge our religion. I frequently speak to multiple people of a high school age from different backgrounds, families, areas, and with different beliefs. While the topic rarely comes up, there have been a few occasions of a debate forming.-Brandon B

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  25. This whole article just blows my mind. I don't know if I should take this as mockery as Christianity or as a warning that Satan is corrupting people's minds and we as Christians need to be on the look out. Satan isnt just someone with a pitch fork and a long red tail, he is real and has the ability to destroy a Christian if we let our gaurd down. I agree with you when you say that we need to confront these sort of things with a loving attitude.
    --Jordan Williams

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  26. The very first time that I heard of this I was so amazed that someone would even think of this and believe it. I never thought about looking at the Flying Spaghetti Monster this way as you mentioned in your blog! We shouldn't criticize these people, we should pray for them instead. This is the first time that I really felt like someone was personally attacking my religion and my God! I also got the chance to talk to my small-group about this...surprisingly, a lot more people have heard about this...more than I expected. I really enjoyed reading and learning more about this on your post! --Brent Clay

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  27. Just one question on Darwinism. Since when has the world come together and agreed that it is the only probable way that our word has come together as it has? Who or What decided that we as a Country approve Dawrinism as a whole to be the only logical explanation for the lives we all live today. While I understand that if you open up to one religion, such as Christianity, than all must be included. But to me that is better that dawrinism being the standard curriculum taught to a very impressionable generation of children.It seems that creation (or evolution) is such a personal, and in most cases religious topic that it shouldn't be taught in schools at all. Excluding of course private schools that have choosen to teach a certain viewpoint that the children's parents agree with. While the ideal would be that a Creationist view would be taught in all schools, its obvious that the word we live in would never allowed such a "ridiculous" outlook to be taught.
    -Audra Staley

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    1. You are a Christian that understands the feeling of others while keeping your beliefs, i wish all Christians were more like you. i support evolution over creationism and believe that it is fine to teach it in private schools but not in public schools religion must not take place in public schools and how can you teach creationism without the bible and that forces religion on to people who might not want it.

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  28. It's really sad to think that people are this out of touch with reality, to just create something to make fun of Christianity. Satan has totally manipulated them to believing otherwise. I believe that we need to love them no matter what but be willing to confront them with the Truth.

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  29. I think it's immature that people want to make fun of Christians like that. It's crazy and all it does is discredit them in my opinion. The fact that they dress as pirates is also pretty immature. Satan really has used and blinded the FSM people. Good article Mr. Mooney. -Gattis

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  30. people like this make me so angry. I do not have much patients for extreme stupidity so atheists are VERY low on my list, but As Chrisians, we need to be respectful of them. Stupid atheists.
    emily hill

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    1. This sounds like "ironic" hipster love. I'll show them how much I love them by calling them "stupid". haha. The atheists involved with the FSM are pretty aggravating. Not all atheists are though.

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  31. I believe that the views of Creation- including Darwinism- should be displayed and taught as theories. Such in the way that you show us different theological viewpoints and allow us to decide for ourselves. The top ten views could easily be taught. I believe that intelligent people will rise up in this world when people allow people to think for themselves. God will reveal himself.
    "Besides, trying to prove God is like defending a lion./ Homie, it don’t need your help. Just unlock the cage."

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  32. I totally think that a college campus is the place where someone's faith is most tested. It seems to be important to have a strong foundation of your faith before you enter college.

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  33. This is part of the reason that I appreciate Worldview class so much. We are learning how to respond to these people by learning exactly what and why they believe. Atheists make fun of Christians, just like Christians make fun of atheists. They both have a dogmatic view and this sometimes hurts Christians in their attempts to talk to atheists. - Mallory Bryant

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  34. I agree that Christians should be ready for anything that may be asked or said to them because of their religion, which can be hard sometimes. I also agree that someone should know what their opposer believes before trying to make an argument or discuss it with them to avoid the conversation leaving a bad impression of a "Christian" on the other person.
    -Megan Ledbetter

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  35. This is a very interesting article. This is why I go to Conway Christian, so when i go to college i will be prepared for situations like these. I have heard from many different places that college is a place that will really test your faith.

    -Christian Cox

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  36. When I saw this on your board last year I just thought to myself, why would anyone do that. It's just so strange to me. Thanks for posting!-Jacob Clanton

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  37. I think it is just ridiculous to start something like the CFSM. I am glad that I go to a private Christian school so that I will be prepared for being exposed to all different kinds of views and still stand firmly in mine.

    -Caleb Dather

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  38. After watching "Expelled", it really opened my eyes to the hatred the world has for even the thought of Intelligent Design. FSM is really just making a mockery of a belief in a God, but at the same time, atheism is denying that there is a God. How can atheist say there is no God, if they first had to deny there is one? It just makes no sense. Every soul on the planet naturally longs for something more, but our pride wants to believe that we are the makers of our world.

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  39. FSM is not a mockery of the belief in god it is more the fight against teaching ID in schools. FSM was created with the belief that it may spread some light to christians on how atheist see religion. You see FSM as rediculous, atheists see Christianity equally so but obviously with less satire than FSM, we know you take your religion seriously and that you feel offended by FSM. Most of the people who "believe in FSM" only do so because they want to keep ID which christians keep trying to push into schools out of science. Religion and science should exist seperatly, as should church and state. I will not try to sway you against ID or point out the multiple inaccuracys in the bible and how a great portion of the bible is copied from other religious text like the old testament. I am happy to let you believe what you want to believe each person has free will and can choose their own path. I simply ask any Christians reading this to take into consideration how others feel and not push their religion on those who do not need it, we do not feel the need to be "saved" from ourselves. PS When you send hate mail to the FSM website we all laugh at it, so stop or keep sending them they are a really good laugh.

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    1. Hi EDGE, I appreciate your input. I actually get very few comments from atheists on here. Some are civil (like yours) and some aren't. I'm happy to publish the civil ones. I'm going to try to respond to your comments in the order you gave them.

      1) I know that FSM is a response to the controversy of teaching ID in schools. I made this very clear in the post. But, it is still mockery. The FSM is meant to be an absurd analogue to God. That doesn't mean that it isn't a serious form of criticism. I took it seriously. Mockery and satire are often serious, even if amusing or cheeky.

      2) Also, I know that many atheists see Christianity as ridiculous. My point was that the FSM and God are not even remotely comparable in their ridiculousness. The God that Christians believe in is not as implausible as the FSM, so it is not a valid analogy. Atheists, I think, could come up with a better analogy, which would be more challenging for Christians to reject. It is just a bad argument from analogy.

      3) You assume that ID is just a veiled form of Christian creationism. I don't think that. I'm actually not in favor of teaching biblical creationism in public schools as science. Science works with observable phenomena, and this is what good ID scientists are trying to do. (I can't speak for crackpot ID "scientists" or crackpot evolutionary "scientists") Good ID scientists believe that there is observable evidence that the cosmos must have been designed by some force/mind. For instance, some say that that there are biological structures that are irreducibly complex and could not, therefore, have come to be by Darwinian evolution.

      4) I appreciate that you are "happy to let [me] believe" what I want. I feel the same toward you. You seem to imply that I am forcing my beliefs upon you. It's a blog, and no one has to read it. Or, perhaps you're referring to Christians "pushing" creationism into schools. I'm not doing that either. I teach Bible/theology at a private school. I don't teach science. Any Christian who is pushing the doctrine of biblical creation as science in the classroom is mistaken as to what science is. See number 3.

      5) I have never sent hate mail to anyone, and the Christians with whom I associate have not either. Additionally, I made every effort to make this post kind, civil, and loving by taking seriously the claims of atheists and responding to them rationally. I know that there are hateful people out there sending hate mail in the name of Christ, and I condemn them here. That doesn't remotely reflect the teaching of Jesus ("Love your enemies"). I don't even consider atheists or other non-Christians to be enemies. Even if I did, love would be the only Christian thing to do. So, please save your accusations and stereotyping. I didn't resort to any kind of atheist stereotyping.

      My overall point that the atheistic/materialistic worldview is incapable of answering a whole lot of other questions, which I asked in the post. If you can answer some of my questions from the post, we can start a good and fruitful conversation.

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  40. i don't even know how i ended up on this website I posted the last comment and i truly hope it was posted as it shows the standpoint of a atheist which i doubt you see very often on what seem a christian only website. Make fun of me as you will, but dont push your religion on me.

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    1. Why do you assume that I'm going to make fun of you? I didn't use that tone in my post. You seem to judge me right from the start without any evidence other than your preconceived notions about Christians.

      Secondly, I'm not pushing my religion on you. I'm just writing a blog that very few people actually read. i don't think that constitutes "pushing" my religion on you. If anything, you came onto my blog to present your beliefs to me. By the way, your beliefs are welcome here as long as they are communicated in a helpful and civil way.

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  41. I'm glad that I found this post. We talked about this in class, how flying spaghetti monster is a straw man fallacy. What I learned by commenting on your several posts is that I actually learned a lot from your class. I've been continuously questioning about the morality of this world, pretty much due to your teaching's influence. Whenever I think about the morality and reason of this world, I feel like I am thinking about something impossible to understand and irreproachable. I guess I feel this way because humans are not the one made the morality, but God. I think I already said this many times in your other posts, but I again want to say thank you for changing my perspective so much.

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